Eh, I think the weakspot in any 3d printing will be the software. As a hobby engineer, I use Solidworks which is several thousand dollars (luckily already on some of my employer's computers so they foot the bill).
But at home, I tried FreeCad, Cubify Invent, and several other free or cheap options and I find them invariably terrible, at least as far my limited experience can discern. FreeCad in particular, asides from UI nonintuitive issues and heaps of bugs (various cuts and operations simply disappearing for no reason), is only up to v0.14 since launching in 2002. It's like the Gnu Hurd of that genre.
I don't see how the 3D printing revolution will remotely come to town without something decent on the software front that's $200 or less.
*Posted this yesterday in a thread, but was too late for anyone to see it.
Wow! It is incredibly refreshing to see a new opportunity for a piece of commercial PC software that is expected to cost more than $2. It must be the first time in about 10 years.
Perhaps one of the established players will decide to bow out of the high-end, and target 3d printing. Or, make a new cut-rate home/small business version, ala Photoshop Elements.
On the open-source side we'll have to see if things turn out more like Gimp or Blender (usable options), or more like the video editing situation
I'd like to see an UnrealEd-style interface for one of these 3D modeling programs.
I've tried Maya, AutoCAD, and a couple of others, and I've not found a more intuitive interface than UnrealEd.
Not the visual part, that's just a standard top/side/front/render quad. I'm talking about the mouse control. Click to drag. Right-click to pan/roll. Chord-click to zoom. It was nearly as intuitive as, well, playing an FPS.
That, and the simplicity of brushes, but without the incomplete feature-set of UEd. Basically, cre
Truespace is a very acessible 3D program. I loved the simplicity of its binary object tools. You might not make the most efficient model in TS, but its solid.
CAD is recognized by the FSF as an area with a lack of suitable Freely-licensed software.
Really? What is wrong with FreeCAD [freecadweb.org]? It is a full parametric 3D modeling system. It can be scripted in Python. It exports industry standard STL. I find it far easier to use than AutoCAD, SolidWorks, or any other CAD program I have used. I have used it for dozens of projects, and have run into no limitations. I have also used it with a 3D printing class at an elementary school for 4th, 5th, and 6th graders. They also had no problems with it. The license is GPL.
Well... I just got FreeCAD running last night. Been using QCad for several years and recently started OpenSCAD for some 3D modeling. So you want a new FreeCAD user's prospective?
I have spent the last 4 nights, 3-4 hours each night, trying to build and install all the dependancies for FreeCAD v0.14 on a CentOS 6.5 box. It was an absolute nightmare. The build documentation is crap and lists multiple things as requirements that have changed to something else (i.e. PyQt4 -> PySide), dependancies claimed to be optional but are infact manditory (i.e. GtWebkit [or, as I did, get fed up and rip out the code... why in the hell do I need a download models option in the open menu? Why is git/svn/etc. demanded in an end-user executable?]), hardcoded -python2.7 version dependancies. This comes after all the mess of compiling half-a-dozen different 3D libriaries each with their own compiling problems.
The first thing after finally getting it open.... the interface is a mish-mash of a dozen different modules with no indications of what to really use... The user has to go and learn every single one, then try to figure out what to use. Examples were installed... but who the hell knows where, there are no example libraries in the menu structure. And python? Why would a end-user want to learn Python just to create an object?
So I try to open a pretty basic STL I made earlier in OpenSCAD (disc with some bolt holes and a flange).... it takes 60+sec to import the STL object, but atleast it looks right. Kind of have the construction tree for the object in panel, but no obvious way to edit the code. I move it a bit, rotate the object around... and then suddenly its gone with a stream of "array[-1]" errors in console... Not a good way to start.
I have spent the last 4 nights, 3-4 hours each night, trying to build and install all the dependancies for FreeCAD v0.14 on a CentOS 6.5 box.
I had no problems at all installing on Ubuntu. At the school we installed onto several old Macbooks, and had no problems there either.
The build documentation is crap
Well, duh. It is open source, so of course the documentation will be crap.
And python? Why would a end-user want to learn Python just to create an object?
You don't have to use Python. It is just an option if you want to write macros or script repetitive tasks. All serious CAD programs have some sort of scripting, and using Python is much better than using some quirky, buggy, customized hack like AutoLISP.
I don't see how the 3D printing revolution will remotely come to town without something decent on the software front that's $200 or less.
Patience... Remember when 20 meg hard drives cost 2000 dollars? Besides the high prices are necessary for keeping a very high bar of entry. There are many disincentives to allowing these things on everybody's kitchen counter top.
I used a trial of GeoMagic Design, and almost purchased it. I think it was Alibre Design, so it somewhat of a Solidworks clone, and is far better than I expected. But my clients use Solidworks, so.....
I also use Rhino, and it does stuff Solidworks can only dream of. It lack full parametrics and a history tree, but has fantastic surface modeling. If you do complex surfaces, this is the one to get.
Cubify Design and Invent - have not tried them, but they likely fit what most people want to do - make simple parts.
Disclosure: I have been a customer for each of these companies, and know people at all three. I used to be a dealer for Solidworks and Rhino 14 years ago, and wish I didn't have to pay full retail today.
Blender, my friend, now has great sculpting tools akin Zbrush and many less travelled options to export for CAM. It is free and supported by a great community.
I used CAD tools as a pro, 10 years ago. I used NX, solidworks, edge, ProE WF, Autocrap, etc. I coded parametric designs from my own designs, I did non-linear hypersonic CFD with fluent and CFX on those designs, I did reverse-kinematic non-linear space robotics on those designs, I did it all.
When I stopped caring about empirical tons of hors
I work at HP, and use my MSDN subscription for 15+ machines at home. Most of it is my pet project, but I did include some stuff in my "work goals" in workaday and I'm not selling any products from my house...or selling windows licenses lol
You should check out Autodesk Fusion 360 (http://fusion360.autodesk.com/about) as they have a free edition for hobbyist and monthly rental if you are commercial.
I can't afford Solidworks. I keep dreaming of having the money but I can buy a lot of real equipment for that price. So I've used free 2d cad and Blender for printer modeling. Recently I've been using the nightly builds of Freecad. The UI is a freaking mess as you have already mentioned however the functionality is finally breaking the barrier of usability in the upcoming 0.15 release. The bugs that you mention are appearing less and less, and at least the backend is becoming more stable.
I think this problem will be solved. Free software is usually written for the programmer. As more programmers get 3D printers, better free software will be produced.
Cheep softare is written for the hobbyist, but that isn't a very large market. As more people buy 3D printers, they'll need software.
We do need a good open source cad program. While not cad both these projects (Art of Illusion and Blender) are fairly good. Blender is getting so much work put into over the last few years, and is getting pretty impressive. If they decided to add a "CAD" mode. It would be implemented fairly fast.
Of course even really good free/cheap CAD does not make everyone a CAD designer or whatever. 3D printers at home will do what most printers do at home. Print clip art (other peoples models) or photos (3d scan).
Where will decent software come from? (Score:5, Interesting)
Eh, I think the weakspot in any 3d printing will be the software. As a hobby engineer, I use Solidworks which is several thousand dollars (luckily already on some of my employer's computers so they foot the bill).
But at home, I tried FreeCad, Cubify Invent, and several other free or cheap options and I find them invariably terrible, at least as far my limited experience can discern. FreeCad in particular, asides from UI nonintuitive issues and heaps of bugs (various cuts and operations simply disappearing for no reason), is only up to v0.14 since launching in 2002. It's like the Gnu Hurd of that genre.
I don't see how the 3D printing revolution will remotely come to town without something decent on the software front that's $200 or less.
*Posted this yesterday in a thread, but was too late for anyone to see it.
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Perhaps one of the established players will decide to bow out of the high-end, and target 3d printing. Or, make a new cut-rate home/small business version, ala Photoshop Elements.
On the open-source side we'll have to see if things turn out more like Gimp or Blender (usable options), or more like the video editing situation
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
I'd like to see an UnrealEd-style interface for one of these 3D modeling programs.
I've tried Maya, AutoCAD, and a couple of others, and I've not found a more intuitive interface than UnrealEd.
Not the visual part, that's just a standard top/side/front/render quad. I'm talking about the mouse control. Click to drag. Right-click to pan/roll. Chord-click to zoom. It was nearly as intuitive as, well, playing an FPS.
That, and the simplicity of brushes, but without the incomplete feature-set of UEd. Basically, cre
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try Caligari trueSpace 3D (Score:2)
Caligari trueSpace 3D which as a long history is really nice.
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Truespace is a very acessible 3D program. I loved the simplicity of its binary object tools. You might not make the most efficient model in TS, but its solid.
Re:Where will decent software come from? (Score:4, Interesting)
CAD is recognized by the FSF as an area with a lack of suitable Freely-licensed software.
Really? What is wrong with FreeCAD [freecadweb.org]? It is a full parametric 3D modeling system. It can be scripted in Python. It exports industry standard STL. I find it far easier to use than AutoCAD, SolidWorks, or any other CAD program I have used. I have used it for dozens of projects, and have run into no limitations. I have also used it with a 3D printing class at an elementary school for 4th, 5th, and 6th graders. They also had no problems with it. The license is GPL.
Re:Where will decent software come from? (Score:4, Interesting)
Well... I just got FreeCAD running last night. Been using QCad for several years and recently started OpenSCAD for some 3D modeling. So you want a new FreeCAD user's prospective?
I have spent the last 4 nights, 3-4 hours each night, trying to build and install all the dependancies for FreeCAD v0.14 on a CentOS 6.5 box. It was an absolute nightmare. The build documentation is crap and lists multiple things as requirements that have changed to something else (i.e. PyQt4 -> PySide), dependancies claimed to be optional but are infact manditory (i.e. GtWebkit [or, as I did, get fed up and rip out the code... why in the hell do I need a download models option in the open menu? Why is git/svn/etc. demanded in an end-user executable?]), hardcoded -python2.7 version dependancies. This comes after all the mess of compiling half-a-dozen different 3D libriaries each with their own compiling problems.
The first thing after finally getting it open.... the interface is a mish-mash of a dozen different modules with no indications of what to really use... The user has to go and learn every single one, then try to figure out what to use. Examples were installed... but who the hell knows where, there are no example libraries in the menu structure. And python? Why would a end-user want to learn Python just to create an object?
So I try to open a pretty basic STL I made earlier in OpenSCAD (disc with some bolt holes and a flange).... it takes 60+sec to import the STL object, but atleast it looks right. Kind of have the construction tree for the object in panel, but no obvious way to edit the code. I move it a bit, rotate the object around... and then suddenly its gone with a stream of "array[-1]" errors in console... Not a good way to start.
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I have spent the last 4 nights, 3-4 hours each night, trying to build and install all the dependancies for FreeCAD v0.14 on a CentOS 6.5 box.
I had no problems at all installing on Ubuntu. At the school we installed onto several old Macbooks, and had no problems there either.
The build documentation is crap
Well, duh. It is open source, so of course the documentation will be crap.
And python? Why would a end-user want to learn Python just to create an object?
You don't have to use Python. It is just an option if you want to write macros or script repetitive tasks. All serious CAD programs have some sort of scripting, and using Python is much better than using some quirky, buggy, customized hack like AutoLISP.
Where will decent software come from? (Score:2)
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I don't see how the 3D printing revolution will remotely come to town without something decent on the software front that's $200 or less.
Patience... Remember when 20 meg hard drives cost 2000 dollars? Besides the high prices are necessary for keeping a very high bar of entry. There are many disincentives to allowing these things on everybody's kitchen counter top.
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Frankly, I never was able to afford any hard drive less than 20MB. They were cheap enough that I could get one.
Re:Where will decent software come from? Here's 4 (Score:5, Informative)
I'm also a Solidworks user. I think you overlooked a few.
GeoMagic Design Elements US$1300.
McNeel Rhino US$ 995
Cubify Design US$ 199
Cubify Invent US$ 49
I used a trial of GeoMagic Design, and almost purchased it. I think it was Alibre Design, so it somewhat of a Solidworks clone, and is far better than I expected. But my clients use Solidworks, so.....
I also use Rhino, and it does stuff Solidworks can only dream of. It lack full parametrics and a history tree, but has fantastic surface modeling. If you do complex surfaces, this is the one to get.
Cubify Design and Invent - have not tried them, but they likely fit what most people want to do - make simple parts.
Disclosure: I have been a customer for each of these companies, and know people at all three. I used to be a dealer for Solidworks and Rhino 14 years ago, and wish I didn't have to pay full retail today.
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
Blender, my friend, now has great sculpting tools akin Zbrush and many less travelled options to export for CAM. It is free and supported by a great community.
I used CAD tools as a pro, 10 years ago. I used NX, solidworks, edge, ProE WF, Autocrap, etc. I coded parametric designs from my own designs, I did non-linear hypersonic CFD with fluent and CFX on those designs, I did reverse-kinematic non-linear space robotics on those designs, I did it all.
When I stopped caring about empirical tons of hors
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I can't afford Solidworks. I keep dreaming of having the money but I can buy a lot of real equipment for that price. So I've used free 2d cad and Blender for printer modeling. Recently I've been using the nightly builds of Freecad. The UI is a freaking mess as you have already mentioned however the functionality is finally breaking the barrier of usability in the upcoming 0.15 release. The bugs that you mention are appearing less and less, and at least the backend is becoming more stable.
I did a sin
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Cheep softare is written for the hobbyist, but that isn't a very large market. As more people buy 3D printers, they'll need software.
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Of course even really good free/cheap CAD does not make everyone a CAD designer or whatever. 3D printers at home will do what most printers do at home. Print clip art (other peoples models) or photos (3d scan).